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Re: [EM] Voting Benchmark

MS
Markus Schulze
Thu, Oct 1, 2015 11:27 AM

Hallo,

The votes only flow if A over B has more votes than B over A
say. On first sight this sounds good but introduces a sensitivity in the
method that can completely flip results with a small change of votes,
also leading to possible loss of votes and tactical voting. Why can't
votes simply flow both directions? In my implementation I tried it and
it still led to dominant results in my experiments, but I guess it's
needed for certain properties?

Here is my paper:

http://m-schulze.9mail.de/schulze1.pdf

The presumption that wins are always stronger that losses is
presumption (2.1.2).

Presumption (2.1.2) is needed to prove compliance with the
Schwartz criterion, the Smith criterion, and independence
of Smith-dominated alternatives.

Presumption (2.1.2) is not needed to prove transitivity,
resolvability, Pareto, monotonicity, reversal symmetry,
or independence of clones.

Markus Schulze

Hallo, > The votes only flow if A over B has more votes than B over A > say. On first sight this sounds good but introduces a sensitivity in the > method that can completely flip results with a small change of votes, > also leading to possible loss of votes and tactical voting. Why can't > votes simply flow both directions? In my implementation I tried it and > it still led to dominant results in my experiments, but I guess it's > needed for certain properties? Here is my paper: http://m-schulze.9mail.de/schulze1.pdf The presumption that wins are always stronger that losses is presumption (2.1.2). Presumption (2.1.2) is needed to prove compliance with the Schwartz criterion, the Smith criterion, and independence of Smith-dominated alternatives. Presumption (2.1.2) is not needed to prove transitivity, resolvability, Pareto, monotonicity, reversal symmetry, or independence of clones. Markus Schulze
MS
Marijn Stollenga
Thu, Oct 1, 2015 5:10 PM

Thank you for the reply. So it seems pretty essential to get these nice
properties. I wonder if there are other ways to get them, i.e. it's not
proven to be the only way to get these properties I guess?

Marijn

On Thu, 2015-10-01 at 13:27 +0200, Markus Schulze wrote:

Hallo,

The votes only flow if A over B has more votes than B over A
say. On first sight this sounds good but introduces a sensitivity
in the
method that can completely flip results with a small change of
votes,
also leading to possible loss of votes and tactical voting. Why
can't
votes simply flow both directions? In my implementation I tried it
and
it still led to dominant results in my experiments, but I guess
it's
needed for certain properties?

Here is my paper:

http://m-schulze.9mail.de/schulze1.pdf

The presumption that wins are always stronger that losses is
presumption (2.1.2).

Presumption (2.1.2) is needed to prove compliance with the
Schwartz criterion, the Smith criterion, and independence
of Smith-dominated alternatives.

Presumption (2.1.2) is not needed to prove transitivity,
resolvability, Pareto, monotonicity, reversal symmetry,
or independence of clones.

Markus Schulze


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Thank you for the reply. So it seems pretty essential to get these nice properties. I wonder if there are other ways to get them, i.e. it's not proven to be the only way to get these properties I guess? Marijn On Thu, 2015-10-01 at 13:27 +0200, Markus Schulze wrote: > Hallo, > > > The votes only flow if A over B has more votes than B over A > > say. On first sight this sounds good but introduces a sensitivity > > in the > > method that can completely flip results with a small change of > > votes, > > also leading to possible loss of votes and tactical voting. Why > > can't > > votes simply flow both directions? In my implementation I tried it > > and > > it still led to dominant results in my experiments, but I guess > > it's > > needed for certain properties? > > Here is my paper: > > http://m-schulze.9mail.de/schulze1.pdf > > The presumption that wins are always stronger that losses is > presumption (2.1.2). > > Presumption (2.1.2) is needed to prove compliance with the > Schwartz criterion, the Smith criterion, and independence > of Smith-dominated alternatives. > > Presumption (2.1.2) is not needed to prove transitivity, > resolvability, Pareto, monotonicity, reversal symmetry, > or independence of clones. > > Markus Schulze > > > ---- > Election-Methods mailing list - see http://electorama.com/em for list > info